Yet another terrible discovery Thread poster: Samuel Murray
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Samuel Murray 
Netherlands
Local time: 18:11
Member (2006)
English to Afrikaans
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Hello everyone
So, when I'm asked to do translations in XTM, there are often no fuzzy matches, so I just translate segment by segment, without worrying about checking fuzzies. Or, I'm often asked to proofread translations that were done in XTM.
When proofreading, I am often struck by how regularly it appears as if translators simply didn't edit fuzzy matches. The fuzzy matches are confirmed, but they weren't actually edited (or they were incompletely edited).
... See more Hello everyone
So, when I'm asked to do translations in XTM, there are often no fuzzy matches, so I just translate segment by segment, without worrying about checking fuzzies. Or, I'm often asked to proofread translations that were done in XTM.
When proofreading, I am often struck by how regularly it appears as if translators simply didn't edit fuzzy matches. The fuzzy matches are confirmed, but they weren't actually edited (or they were incompletely edited).
Later, I discovered that there is a feature in XTM (that is enabled by default) whereby a segment gets confirmed as soon as you click somewhere else (you can disable this behaviour in the settings). So if a translator puts his cursor in a fuzzy matched segment, don't do anything, and then click in another segment, XTM considers the segment to have been edited and confirmed.
I now discovered another cause for what I've been seeing.
Today I'm tasked with translating a job in XTM that has about 50 high fuzzy matches, so I decided to edit the fuzzy matches first. I filtered the "unedited fuzzy matches", then changed the settings so that the segment status is not changed automatically (i.e. I have to press Alt+; to confirm a segment) and so that repeated segments are NOT updated:
Then I went ahead and edited the fuzzy matches and used Alt+; to confirm them and used Alt+right to move to the next segment each time. So, in my of thinking, therefore, if a fuzzy match did have a repetition, then that repetition would NOT be updated automatically and (it goes without saying) the unedited repetition's status would not be changed to e.g. Confirmed.
Fortunately, I double-check my translations in Wordfast Classic, and that is when I discovered a horrible truth: yes, XTM did not update the content of the repetitions, but XTM *did* mark repetitions as confirmed. So, a repetition of a fuzzy match gets "confirmed" when the first instance of that repetition gets confirmed, even if only the first instance of the fuzzy match had been edited. Why????????
So, despite that the setting is called "Update text and status of repeated segments in the current file", and you select "Do not update segments", it *does* update the statuses of those segments, even though the content is not updated.
The result of this behaviour was that I had several confirmed segments (which I did not confirm myself) which contained unedited fuzzy matches (because I had edited only the first instance of each repetition).
I have long stopped being upset by sloppy translations in XTM when it is clear that the "sloppiness" is the result of an unedited fuzzy match or the result of an incompletely edited segment that was autopropagated, because I know that the translators are not at fault. Today, I too was not sloppy -- I was being extra careful -- and still XTM managed to screw it up.
So, I then had to re-check all confirmed segments very carefully (and this time, the fuzzy match comparison pane did not help, because the unedited fuzzy matches were now considered exact matches with the TM). I'm very fortunate that there were only 50 segments and that checking them took only an extra half an hour of my time... and here I am giving discounts for fuzzy matches.
What is the lesson to be learnt here? Never check pre-translated fuzzy matches in XTM. Translate such segments from scratch, and refuse to give discounts for fuzzy matches in XTM because they actually cost MORE time than just translating from scratch. And if the client is unhappy because they're not getting consistency with the TM, well, then we should educate such clients that that is what you get from a CAT tool that is designed to produce faulty translations.
When clients choose XTM, they want to benefit from discounts for fuzzy matches, but they require that the translator use a tool that is booby-trapped, and then the translator's reputation suffers when (through no fault of his own) his translation ends up with confirmed unedited fuzzy matched segments.
Samuel ▲ Collapse
| | | | | It is indeed terrible | May 4, 2023 |
That's incredible. These programs are made FOR translators, to simplify our jobs. It boggles the mind to think that they would allow something so fundamentally wrong to pass unnoticed.
| | | | Daryo
United Kingdom
Local time: 17:11
Serbian to English
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Sergio Di Lorenzo wrote:
That's incredible. These programs are made FOR translators, to simplify our jobs. It boggles the mind to think that they would allow something so fundamentally wrong to pass unnoticed.
These programs may well be supposedly made FOR translators, but they don't seem to have been made BY translators, nor in consultation WITH translators.
The impression I had last time I took a look at one these CAT tools, and you confirmed it.
| | | | Kay Denney
France
Local time: 18:11
French to English
Sergio Di Lorenzo wrote:
That's incredible. These programs are made FOR translators, to simplify our jobs. It boggles the mind to think that they would allow something so fundamentally wrong to pass unnoticed.
They are not made for translators. The very first CAT was, but the secret got out and now CAT tools are made for translators' clients.
I saw this first-hand when working in an office where others were working on CAT tool development. Not once did anyone ask me what I thought of the software as a translator. PMs' opinions were taken into account though!
I did volunteer some suggestions on several occasions, showing them how they could improve the interface, make it easier for the translator to copy/paste, have the editing options resemble those in Word because editing options in Word are always much better than in any CAT tool. Not a single one of my suggestions ever made it into the CAT tool.
And any time an agency called with complaints about how the software worked, you bet they'd listen and rush to find a solution. Translators were ignored entirely, even when they'd paid for the software. The agencies paid more for their version, you see.
(Not surprisingly, that company's CAT tool is all but dead now)
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| The listening developer | May 6, 2023 |
Kay Denney wrote:
They are not made for translators. The very first CAT was, but the secret got out and now CAT tools are made for translators' clients.
I used to use cat tools that were developed with agencies in mind. Luckily, I got in touch with a developer —and translator at that time— who was willing to listen to my needs as a translator. And still is.
They do exist: cat tools that are created for freelance translators.
| | | | Daryo
United Kingdom
Local time: 17:11
Serbian to English
+ ...
| Unfortunately | May 6, 2023 |
Hans Lenting wrote: Kay Denney wrote:
They are not made for translators. The very first CAT was, but the secret got out and now CAT tools are made for translators' clients. I used to use cat tools that were developed with agencies in mind. Luckily, I got in touch with a developer —and translator at that time— who was willing to listen to my needs as a translator. And still is. They do exist: cat tools that are created for freelance translators.
Yes, occasionally you stumble on CAT tools made BY translators FOR translators, they do exist. There are few of them - but it's like finding rare gems in a mountain of trash.
Unfortunately, they are more like a rare exception to the general rule. (a.k.a. "l'exception qui confirme la règle")
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