Jan 8, 2016 03:57
8 yrs ago
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Portuguese term

desvinculados de lucro

Portuguese to English Law/Patents Human Resources Profit sharing contract
The full phrase is: "Os valores pagos a título de participação nos resultados, desvinculados de lucro..." - in a Brazilian collective bargaining agreement. The basis of my confusion here is differentiating between "resultados" and "lucro" in this context.

Discussion

Martin Riordan Jan 8, 2016:
Yes, I suspect that the person typing this up should have used the word "remuneração" instead of "lucro". This is the legal norm: amounts paid out as profit sharing are not considered as wage or salary for the purposes of labour and welfare charges.
Thomas O'Gara (asker) Jan 8, 2016:
rdemarch, I suspect that in this case Mr Riordan is correct; the text says "Os valores pagos a título de Participação nos Resultados, desvinculados de lucro, não constituem base de incidência de qualquer cargo trabalhista or previdenciario, não se lhes aplicando o principio de habitualidade nos termos do artigo terceiro da lei 10101…" which pretty clearly shows that the concern here was about deducting taxes and social security from the profit sharing, not about profits vs. revenue.
Martin Riordan Jan 8, 2016:
@ rdemarch While in principle I would agree with you, this would require that the word "resultados" have a different meaning to "profit". As far as I know, it is only used as a synonym of profit, although I understand that the Demonstrativo do Resultado can also be an interim profit and loss statement, before the end of the financial year. It could mean that "profit sharing" can be paid out during the year, based on an interim P&L statement, even if at the end of the year the company posts losses.

More context would help to form an opinion.
rdemarch Jan 8, 2016:
Let me suggest a note of caution here. Often in collective bargaining in Brazil, a clause is inserted that will guarantee a bonus payment once or twice per year. It is only indirectly related to profits, because the bargaining is done before a P/L statement for the period is issued, or even if bargained after the P/L it may not be taken in consideration.

This happens often in labor negotiations. Union leaders are not interested in carefully considering the profitability of the company. They will consider only optimistic scenarios and will be distrustful of arguments by directors of reduced profitability. They will insist on a bonus payment for their employees only theoretically linked to profit.

In actuality, as the two answerers responded, this payment is unlinked/unbound to profit

As a result, I would not immediately consider this a typo.

My 2 cents worth!
Thomas O'Gara (asker) Jan 8, 2016:
Mr Riordan is right...the document references law 10101/2000 directly. It was a typo in the original.
Martin Riordan Jan 8, 2016:
A typing mistake? Many references that appear in a Google search refer to "...participação nos resultados ou lucro, desvinculado da remuneração,...".

I suspect that whoever drafted or typed up the document you are translating made a mistake. "resultados" and "lucro" are synonyms except, perhaps, in very specialised contexts. Law 10101/2000, which deals with profit-sharing, also uses them as synonyms.

The text on this page is typical of the references:
http://www.direitonet.com.br/artigos/exibir/1879/A-participa...

Proposed translations

4 hrs

unrelated/unlinked to profit

Declined
My suggestion.
Something went wrong...
8 hrs

not bound to the profits

Declined
Sugestão
Something went wrong...
10 hrs

non-profit linked

Declined
This is a common expression in the financial field, often used to describe incentives, payments, schemes etc.
Something went wrong...
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